Pic of the Week

Closing notice for Moore Square

Looks like it is actually happening after so many years. Moore Square will close down this November and the redesign takes place throughout 2018.

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  1. OMG I thought that this project would never start! Now as long as we don’t see this sign still around in 2020, (like that crane on Hillsborough st) then I will be much happier…Lol

  2. Sorry, completely off topic, but does anyone know what is going on with all the boarded up old frat houses in the neighborhood across Hillsborough St from NC State?

  3. Off topic but I had an idea that I want to run by some people…

    Could the city use the Stadium/Office Building Complex proposed by Malik/Kane to help lure Amazon? Would there be enough space in those towers to support Amazon? I doubt it but I was just curious.

  4. For eventual 50,000 employees they need a 100 acre site, unless they plan on building 80 story towers.

    I hope Amazon goes elsewhere.

  5. Think the only way Raleigh has a chance at Amazon is if some of the HQ were designated downtown with a couple 500+ft towers and some infill 10-20 story towers while the rest of the HQ was put out in RTP or some other style office park. Then light rail was built to connect all of it as well as to the airport. Pretty far fetched.

  6. Pittsburgh is no really ‘rust belt’. Pittsburgh as a city is doing quite well. The steel companies are still headquartered there, they have several notable universities based there and over the lat 15 years the city core has made dramatic strides in the tech sector. Hell, Raleigh’s tallest building and currently only arena/stadium is emblazoned with a bank logo from an institution based in Pittsburgh.

    Why on earth would any of you wish another city get such a transformational economic event over Raleigh?

  7. Uncle Jesse, I didn’t mean it as pejorative. I’m well-acquainted with the city and am rather fond of it, but it is still losing population and transitioning to a modern economy, which is what I meant.

    If Amazon did choose the Triangle, it would be as big as the next three largest employers combined (in Wake Co). Raleigh would essentially live and die with Amazon, like any other company town. I’m not convinced that’s a good thing.

  8. I would love to see Amazon set up shop in an economically depressed area but this HQ2 game isn’t being played with a virtuous set of rules.

    Amazon is pitting one city against another intent on “extracting” the best incentives package possible. Think about it … Amazon could easily do their own research on whichever city best suits their needs. In fact I’d bet my bottom dollar they already have! This RFP is all about the incentives. It is the only requirement in their RTP that is unknowable to them.

    One theory I haven’t yet heard mention of is that Amazon, in reality, has little intention of setting up an HQ2 elsewhere but every intention of playing political “hardball” with those Seattle politicians who refuse to kowtow to their every need.

  9. Looks like the Dillon is being topped out soon. I’ve read 17 floors and also 18. Anyone know which is correct? Looks like they are finishing the 17th floor now. This is a perfect building for this location simply for the aesthetic side. Now much taller buildings could go between the Dillon and Fayetteville Street and it would have a free flowing look. Now if we could only get a monster or 2 on that Enterprise block.

  10. That block South of Nash square already has a proposed new hotel on the SE corner and new businesses (imurj/whiskey kitchen) which are doing well. For me, I want the auto shop on the SW corner of that block to be repurposed, see whiskey kitchen, and the one across the street. Then retrofit and breathe new life into the businesses facing Nash square beside the Berkeley cafe, and you have a continuous block of engaging street frontage that retains the character of what was originally there.

    Mantra: Not taller buildings, more continuous engaging pedestrian experience.

  11. @Evan, I’m with you. Let’s get a contiguous pedestrian experience first and foremost. That’s what drives the energy downtown. Once that occurs, the value of land increases and redevelopment throughout DT will become more vertical. While it may appear that we are quickly losing our development opportunities, consider that many existing developed sites will be seen as underutilized and redeveloped.

  12. The problem is only 1/3 of the block has buildings on it. There is alot of unused/surface parking area on that block. The hotel would be nice, just wish it were bigger. I’m in the camp of wanting 2 big hotels vs. 7 or 8 small ones.

  13. Dillion 17 floors but they omitted labeling 13, so the top floor will say 18. Crowder negotiated the height from 18 to 17

  14. Also, I firmly am behind Evan’s and John’s statements. RE the Hilton Garden, I wish it were *nicer. The rendering really went from pretty good to brown-note box.

  15. “Hey I’m a developer with deep pockets I want to build an 18 story building downtown!”
    Crowder: “Make it one story less just because I suck.”

    Heavily agree with the notion to keep the Nash facing buildings intact, though some could use a makeover (The old Raleigh Times building has had a blown up image of what it used to look like in the window for a while now, I’ve been waiting to see if someone was going to renovate it to look more like it used to). But allll that surface parking around it?? Build up! They could build a taller tower in the middle of the block, and have a smaller building surround it that reaches out to the street, as a step down to the other older buildings that still exist there, just like that new tower in Durham (for this location, we’d be lucky if the city allowed even a 10 story building, which is asinine but here we are…)

  16. I am sick of all the old buildings getting torn down, “historic” status or not. The Remedy Diner building really gets to me… Sure it’s only 2 stories, but it’s been there since the 20s, I believe? It’s helped shape what Raleigh “looks like” for almost 100 years. And now it’s just gonna get demolished and forgotten. The lots on either side of it are prime for redevelopment thank you very much, work around the existing structure. It’s as much the fault of the (usually local) owners of these properties for caving and selling to these (mostly) out-of-state developers who don’t give a flying rat’s behind about Raleigh, but are just following the money. I do not want to see Raleigh grow up into a real city at the expense of losing everything that has made Raleigh “RALEIGH” up till now.

  17. PIPE DREAM TIME! Amazon builds high-rise at N&O site, (maybe Enterprise site or surface lots south of Marriott/Charter), brings in 50,000 people plus their families, making us the OBVIOUS choice for MLB expansion! Right, Dwight?!? (A guy can dream right)?

    Seriously though, the way that NC State collaborates with private industry at Centennial Campus, and the availability of land and a highly educated workforce there, think that could be an option for part of Amazon’s campus? Maybe extend a light-rail spur from Union Station to Centennial and on to RDU?

  18. We are not getting Amazon and we are not getting MLB. We are probably not even getting MLS. Not being negative at all, just being realistic.

  19. I enjoy the conversation on the Amazon HQ2 topic. Yes it’s fantasy. But a stimulating topic for us urban development fans!

    I follow numerous cities and everyone is taking a shot at this, which is very healthy. It’s getting each region to consider a large scale approach to link all the important aspects that would be desirable for a large business. It’s great fun! Nashville, Charlotte, Atlanta have lots of discussion on various sites that are quite interesting.

    My top guess sites for HQ2:
    1. DC (but it’s several states, so may have an problem with getting the incentives lined up).
    2. Atlanta (but is there bias against southern cities?)

    Dark Horse sites for HQ2:
    1. Detroit (would be the most transitional of all the sites)
    2. RTP (small market, and short on transit, but may have the best incentives package).

    I’d caution those on this forum that cannot see a chance of big things happening for the RDU area. No one thought IBM would come here and kick off RTP. Or that RedHat and SAS would become billion dollar empires started in the area. Or that pro Hockey would come here. I think more big things are destined for the RDU area. The positive energy and momentum favor more good things to happen…

  20. Some people sell us short. Raleigh does have a chance for Amazon. I’m not saying we’re a favorite, but we’re definitely in the conversation. Same goes for MLS. Steve Malik is making a competitive case for MLS to choose Raleigh. I hoping for both!

  21. I agree with both Paul and KenA. I’m 37 years old born and raised in Raleigh. I wouldn’t put nothing past this city based on how I’ve seen the city evolve from birth. The Raleigh area continues to grow at a fast pace with more and more momentum. The entire area has seen a sort of renaissance with kinds of construction in areas the city hasn’t seen before. Amenities such a Dix Park, downtown stadium, relaid I-440, road widening project across the entire city, ect. matter greatly in the big picture. I wouldn’t count out this area for anything on a massive scale. Our location (in the US) is conducive for big business, low cost of living, one of the largest and best public school system in the nation, some of the best colleges in the nation, high population of graduates, low crime, great weather. As a Raleigh native, I’m kind of worried about massive growth and the negative impacts that big business can do to a city like Raleigh but its not what’s done, it’s ALWAYS how it’s done. That’s why I think transportation has a direct impact on our future success. Wasn’t too happy with the outcome of the new transportation bond that was given the green light last election season. I believe light rail (of some sort) to better connect this region would give us a hand up how the area grows. I understand higher taxes would be apart of the equation but some sort of massive transportation system that’s independent of the current system we have now is inevitable and I would rather tackle that problem now rather than later. Doesn’t have to resemble NYC just something that connects major centers throughout the region and connects those stops with buses. I’m almost sure that we’ll look back on this and regret not implementing light rail. The rail that was proposed and adopted with the bus plan isn’t sufficient enough and won’t be as effective without the backbone of mass commuter rail that connects major centers throughout the region. A project of this scale requires counties of Wake, Durham, Orange, (Johnston?) to collaborate together so that the cost is distributed reasonably. *notice I said reasonably, not fairly*

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