Pic of the Week

Stone's Warehouse, March 2017

Demolition is taking place at Stone’s Warehouse. The project is moving along now as the former Rex Senior Center is coming down and new art projects line Davie Street. Banners on the front of the warehouse tease a 2018 opening.

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  1. There is a lot of work to do in order to be ready by 2018…
    Is that really feasible or truly just a tease?

  2. If they’ve already jumped through all the city’s hoops and have full permits to proceed, I don’t see why they couldn’t finish in 20 months (Nov ’18 delivery)

  3. @Evan: As a rule, renovations take a lot longer than new construction due to unforeseen issues, working around existing construction that is intended to be saved, etc.

  4. From what I have seen.. Monarch typically gets things done fairly quickly. This looks like an awesome project. I’m really excited about the Fish Market going in!

    Curious how it will compare to the Morgan St. Food Hall. Looks like it will be a bit larger and will be nice with the Townhouses as well.

  5. This is just a guess but I think Monarch may have been waiting for three big sales they just made to go through before beginning….two biggish two story places on Hargett and the one moved to East/New Bern. That freed up a nice chunk of change.
    They do move fast, and also….they did’t say what part of 2018…could be December. My guess, though, is this come online in phases since there are4 distinct buildings on the site.

  6. I know many a sick of MLS/Stadium rumors, but I’ve got one more to share.

    If you didn’t see in the move, NCFC has purchased CASL and TFC and moved them under one umbrella as a developmental academy. This definitely strengthens our bid as it gives NCFC one of the most robust developmental academies in the US (I’ve heard top 5, including some MLS teams).

    So here’s where the rumor comes into play. I was talking to my friend who works in CASL about the merger and I asked him if he had any knowledge of the stadium deal. He’s heard from many people within CASL that it’s going in Dix Park. I asked him what they’re waiting for and he said for the MLS to give them permission to release the plans.

    The rumor mill is fun…

  7. @Paul. Thanks for the update. I’ve been talking here about Dix as a possible location for several weeks now after searching unsuccessfully for an easy alternative in Downtown proper. If it’s true, I wonder exactly where it’s proposed within the park?
    If this does prove to be true, I expect massive protests by those who will not consider giving one square inch of land to such a venture. If I were packaging such proposal, I’d be thinking very carefully of my responses to the community. Having such a facility better come with access to the youth soccer community and should have an economic benefit to the community that extends past just the use for MLS games. As I’ve mentioned previously, I support a location within the park adjacent to the Farmer’s Market in order to share parking resources and positioning it near the Caraleigh neighborhood so that neighborhood would economically enhanced and the downtown footprint/experience would extended to the southwest.
    Alas, I don’t expect that to happen. I expect that it would go near the existing soccer park resources close to Western and across the street from Central Prison.

  8. @ Paul & John 532 , With Jim Goodmon being part of The Dix Conservatory & him being a MLS Investor on this Project , this may just happen !

  9. Well, dang. Looking at the entire site, not many places make sense but the ones that do, really do. John532, in the Caraleigh direction, wedging up immediately west of the Farmers Market, across from Achievement Drive provides a nice connection to Centennial Campus (if that even matters) but yeah, sharing existing parking at the Farmers Market, would be an answer to a chief point of contention, paving over this beautiful parkland. There a topographic challenges there, but I think they site is a little more level higher up from the last time I cut through there. This site would also not touch the big field, one of the main green assets of the area too. The only other place that even remotely makes sense to me, is wedged between the existing fields and Kirby St and utilizing the Pullen St extension for site access. You could also then easily park and ride from the Reynolds parking deck. The cyclocross folks wouldn’t be happy about that, but their course might be doomed with the planned roads anyway, stadium or not…

  10. All the land west of Biggs Dr, except two small parcels, is owned by NC State and not part of Dix Park. NC State plans to put buildings on all that land according to the master plan.

  11. @Paul , Super ! Paul , It seems like I read on this site that someone wrote that the site that you just mention was a ex landfill & could not be approved for a stadium ! I may be wrong about this !

  12. The site on Dorothea Dix Park that I think makes most sense from a stadium and urban development perspective is “The Healing Place Lease” on Lake Wheeler next to the Farmer’s Market. See the map linked to this page: https://www.raleighnc.gov/parks/content/ParksRec/Articles/Parks/DorotheaDixPark.html However, it appears that this is unavailable unless Goodman and Malik could buyout the lease and relocate that facility. I doubt that this would happen. But, if it did happen, the stadium would be perched up the hill and would have glorious views of DT from the upper seats.
    A boy can dream!

  13. Dwight there is definitely a landfill there. Luckily its just the soccer fields themselves right up to the creek banks (or unlucky for the creek and us humans). I’m not sure of the contents or if test bores coming up negative for toxic stuff would allow it or not….but landfill is terrible support fill..its full of voids and decomposing stuff that cannot support a load so whether due to landfill rules, or engineering constraints, my guess is any structure directly on that outline, requirers digging out the entire landfill. Mega mega expensive without brownfield money backing you up. Plus there is a cemetery there that won’t be going anywhere. My guess is it gets pushed right up in the corner of Hunt and Umstead (assuming all of this is true about Dix in general)

  14. How is it.. that every topic Leo puts on here… Soccer is brought up???

    This particular post is regarding the Stone’s Warehouse!

  15. Here comes 36 comments speculating where the imaginary soccer stadium for the imaginary team will be located.

    On another note:
    Has anyone noticed the brick Stone’s warehouse style masonry building on the west side of Capital heading into downtown? It’s part of the City’s public works annex that will one day become a park.

    This would be an awesome opportunity for redevelop in a similar way Stone’s warehouse is being redeveloped.

    Odds are it will be torn down.

  16. I haven’t, but if it’s in the Devereaux Meadows property, you’re probably right.
    In regards to the actual Stone’s Warehouse, TBJ recently ran an article about the 10 mondernist “townhomes” that are actually “condos” on New Bern, about a block away from this development. Between these, the Stone’s Warehouse townhomes, and the Hargett Place (plus, I know there are a few others under consideration), this neighborhood is changing pretty rapidly. The New Bern ones are going for over 400K and apparently are already 40% pre-sold. I’m glad new development in the area seems to be concentrating on townhomes, there are still a lot of empty parcels over there and it would be a shame if they were built as detached houses.


  17. Drew,

    Lol, yeah just like solar being the next great energy source for the past 30 years, not! Here it comes.

  18. @Steve, 10 Arros is not a block away from Stone’s Warehouse. It’s on the north side of the Raleigh City Cemetery on New Bern, about 3-4 blocks N/NE of Stone’s. I say 3-4 blocks because the northernmost block between them is a really long one that is bisected to the east and west of the cemetery/elementary school,
    It will be very interesting to see what happens in this edge community going forward since the UDO doesn’t allow allow anything east of East St. taller than 3 stories.

  19. Hey Guys , A Non – Soccer Post from me ! Charter North will start by Christmas ! Super !

  20. Awesome news Dwight, I hope it actually happens that project seems to have stalled out one to many times to count now!

  21. Hello All – Saw this morning on EatRaleigh Twitter that Domino’s Pizza is coming into the bottom of the Edison at 135 E Davie St.

  22. haha! Yeah.. well.. happy to see something going in. I think the bottom of the Edison has been successful so far. The DGX is great! It was much needed and its a really great store! As well Amorino, the gelato place. They did a great job with that.. the inside looks awesome! Also very excited about the Raleigh Provisions coming in as well as Sir Water Coffee! Would have been nice if they put in space for retail as well other than the bottom floor units.

  23. Raleigh Provisions is open just not fully stocked (and doesn’t have it’s beer license yet either). Has some cool stuff. I hope they can sell enough to pay that likely high rent. DGx fills a legit need too. I shop there probably too much and it’s always full of people. Prices are good too (as you might expect from a Dollar General cousin). I did notice Edison has one small empty space…I guess that’s where Dominoes is going. Totally fine with me. Something needs to put a damper on the $12 lunch/$25 dinner/$15 brunch scene in this town. Everywhere I travel on this planet, I can find good, yet affordable food…except Raleigh’s downtown (not saying Dominoes is good…). John532, FWIW I was standing at the 10arros site the other day and can see the Hargett Place stuff to the southwest….being able to see both gave me the warm fuzzy of a community being formed. Having said that, the key to this whole side of town is somehow changing or getting rid of the Martin Street strip center. I realize Stones is a good distance from there, but any negative perception of the area, and subsequent success of things like Stones, is firmly rooted to that ‘shopping center’. Leo knows it well and is actively trying to fix the situation (Leo you are quite the rock star neighborhood leader). Nonetheless I am quite hopeful that Stones is both an extension of a low key downtown vibe and a neighborhood shopping district. The other day I spent money at Quality Grocery/Brewerks, Gringo and the Rebus Saturday market and have to say, that’s how I like to live…floating out and about in the medium density, neighborhood oriented, yet urban places. The townhouse uptick, and Stones have me excited that it should expand that sort of experience.

  24. RE: Dix. Was there a week ago… the playground at south corner of Biggs & Palmer was cleared and a sign said construction starting soon. Any idea for what?

  25. johnny, haha whatever. I’m legit curious, but guess we’ll find out at some point. Obviously its not a soccer stadium if that’s what got you worked up. I guess I should ask if anyone KNOWS the plan, the mindless speculating here definitely keeps me away from this site more.

  26. @John532,
    Haha, when I say “like a block” I mean “a short walk away”, but you’re right, it’s definitely not a block away. The big question is what’s going to happen with the big field next to Exploris? I’m not sure if Leo or anyone else who lives over there knows the history of that spot, but it seems like commercial development along New Bern and rowhouses on the southern side of it could be really nice. That space looks big enough for a few dozen homes and some neighborhood stores.

  27. Here’s what I know, or been told, about that piece of land. (correct me if I’m wrong) The 8 acres of undeveloped land at the corner of Swain and New Bern has actually been undeveloped ever since that entire area was farmland. I imagine there isn’t much utility there or anything to tap into.

    It is (or was?) owned by Gordon Smith, a big supporter of East Raleigh and land owner. I met Smith a few times and he was one of the big players around making The Lincoln happen. He orchestrated moving all the houses off the Lincoln block into other parts of East Raleigh. He believed saving a house was a better approach than destroying a house, mainly for environment reasons. (didn’t want to send a perfectly good house to the landfill)

    He’s also a big supporter of what Exploris is doing and crafted the deal between them to temporarily operate on Swain Street. Although he’s made it clear that it’s temporary, as we now know that they’ll be moving to City Gateway.

    No one knows what is to become of that land to be honest and we could speculate all day. It is zoned Neighborhood Mixed-Use with a height limit of 3-stories. That means retail up to the street is allowed, with offices or residential on top. It could also be single-family homes, keeping with most of the nearby neighborhood.

    What MAY complicate this land is that it sits inside the New Bern – Edenton Neighborhood Conservation Overlay District. (NCOD) My first experience with this NCOD is related to the 10 Arros townhomes, now being worked on, see them here. https://www.10arros.com/

    I want to save the rest for a blog post but in short, the NCOD limits what kind of residential can take place. I THINK this directly impacts what the neighborhood mixed-use designation actually allows, so there may be a conflict. I need to confirm this with someone from the city.

    I’ve been meaning to look into it so will get back to it soon.

  28. Thanks Leo for the post. The temporary exploris site will most likely get developed when exploris moves to Gateway Center. The lot at 540 E. Hargett is in for site plan also which will help Hargett Oaks clean up or sell out. It is amazing how much the area has improved. Give it time everyone. Land prices in that area have doubled and houses are being snatched up renovated and sold. The Exum property at the corner of Rock Quarry & MLK is being looked at for redevelopment.
    @Drew the City’s old garage site is in a flood zone and will be used by NCDOT for staging Peace Street bridge replacement project. Afterwards it will be a greenway extension & park but hopefully a “riverwalk” or in our case shallow creek with restaurants on West Street overlooking the greenway.

  29. Leo, thanks for this blog (which I don’t say enough… I read it twice a day). Seeing you post in the comments with the same well-articulated and well-reasoned style as your articles shows how much you care, and what an asset you are to all of us who care about our city.

    That being said, I also like the soccer speculation posts. Sorry! ;-)

  30. BC, I never thought about that idea, but a restaurant/retail/entertainment area by a greenway creek would actually work and be pretty neat!

  31. @Jeff @BC – I have long thought that West St, not only between Wade and Peace, but extending all the way into the Warehouse district could be a great retail strip, with more retail/restaurant runoff on the side streets. Would also love to see even more retail all along N Harrington, creating a full on retail district. West St between Peace and Wade would be the most interesting spot because of those views – almost gives you the feeling you’re in Asheville, which also has the type of retail Raleigh should aspire for, IMO.

  32. Yeah, I agree… I would love to see a nice retail/restaurant district. I think Glenwood South would be a prime spot for this. Once the West Side of Glenwood is developed.. bring in more restaurants and retail… a great strip to stop, shop and eat.

  33. Hey @John532. No, the west side. The west side outside of the stretch from Plates to Armadillo Grill has a lot of potential for additional buildings with restaurants and retail. My dream is for Glenwood towers to move to another location and a huge multipurpose building with floors of retail, restaurants and condos to go in its place… maybe with an Apple store (or something else as an anchor) . Once the east side developes, then the whole strip through there would be great. And with everything that is going on with West st, the whole area has potential to be the Restaurant/Retail District of Downtown Raleigh.

    Also – I asked this earlier, but didn’t get much response. I think the Stones Warehouse is going to be awesome! Very excited about it. How does everything think it will compare to the Morgan St. Food Hall? I haven’t heard much about it lately? Looks like Stone’s already has some great tenants wanting to go in.. and looks like they have much more space.. and even have townhouses.

  34. @TheNightHawk – I think they will be different enough, and far enough away from each other to coexist. Morgan St Foodhall already has some food and retail tenants lined up, check out their website!

  35. @TheNightHawk, much of the opportunity on the west side of Glenwood is filled in to the new zoning maximums or close to it. I agree and look forward to the day that Glenwood Tower is replaced but I don’t hold my breath. Like the east side of DT, with its 3 story limit, the west side is pretty much the same. The NW corner of the neighborhood is the exception and much of that area is already developed….save for some key lots including Capital Tower.
    As it stand, the Glenwood South neighborhood is probably already the most densely populated neighborhood in the city and it will only increase in density as the West St. corridor is developed. Small projects will likely infill certain parcels on the west side but most of the big project opportunities have already been realized…not all but most.

  36. West side of Glenwood seems pretty well developed to me. Noir is the only I don’t really care for…but I tend to not clubs that have massive peaks in business on the weekend and nothing at all during the week going on. C Grace has more weekday traffic and that nice porch overlooking the street. Armadillo is that rare affordable eating spot that is also has good food. It’s got foot traffic all of the time. Eventually Glenwood towers financials will dictate selling their land…RHA has made moves in the past to sell prime land to get more money for a net gain in units in other parts of the City. My guess is its already being discussed since i never ever see in maintenance being done…and it needs a lot. As an aside, it straddles another segment of Pigeon House Branch which is currently culverted so…potential restaurants facing the creek here as well. Page 18 of the 1914 Sanborn maps show a fairly large house on the big field sitting pretty close to New Bern. It has a rectangular bay window and 2 story one bay wide porch and also a stone once car garage behind it. http://dc.lib.unc.edu/cdm/compoundobject/collection/ncmaps/id/9084/rec/6
    It short, it really never has been developed except right in the Swain and New Bern corner about 15 shotgun houses were there as of 1914 and are all now gone.

  37. @Mark, Very cool map. Thanks for the link. I had no idea that, what is called Glenwood South today was named N. Saunders in the past.

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